Is this a bayonet for an AK?

[Beryl]

Halo,
Can anyone help with identification

Is this an AK bayonet?
If so, to what and what country of production?

Best Regards Rafal

[Beryl]

photo

[Beryl]

Photo

[pwcosol]

Rafal:
Have not been to the Forum for some time, but glad I decided to do so today! Your Ak bayonet is unknown to me. I found neither mention or photos of an example like yours in any of my AK bayonet reference books either. In the main, it appears to be a Soviet style 6X3 so far as the blade, cross guard/muzzle ring, latching system and grips go. However, the entire rear end is highly modified from the standard 6X3 which only attaches to the AK47. It may a transitional prototype of the 6X4 (AKM) bayonet. With the top area of the pommel deeply machined out and "U" cutout on the pommel head, this would allow accommodation of the bayonet lug and cleaning rod of either a AKM or AK74. The scabbard most closely resembles that of the Polish AK47 bayonet, but suspension and how it is attached to the scabbard are more like that of the Soviet 6X2. Looking forward to additional commentary from forum members. BTW, would like to know the inside diameter of the muzzle ring as well...

[Mr. B.]

Hi Rafal,
I agree with Pwcosol. I have never seen any thing like it, but it is interesting! Time for more research? My answer would be that it could possibly be a Kalashinkov design. The mounting / locking system is similar to the AK47 bayonets. I am unaware of anyone else using the “dragon’s teeth” design. Logically it should work with the hilt locking in on a barrel mounting lug
and the barrel / muzzle ring as front support. I am picturing an AK47 with a barrel extending several inches past the original front sight base. It could also be a modification to fit on an AKM or newer weapon.
I think the clue here is the unique Polish style scabbard body as mentioned. That, and you being from Poland, I suspect some type of new or revised Polish design using the Kalashnikov locking design!? I would like to see the internal parts of the latch spring etc..The hilt / pommel looks very solid? Mike
I

[Beryl]

The bayonet was not purchased in Poland.
Purchased from the bayonets group for the Zastava M56.
I only have a suspicion that it may be related to Yugoslavia or the countries of the former Yugoslavia
Mint condition
Without control markings
The number 3138 is burned into the handle covers
The letters on the handle written in electro-ink are BK TK
There is an ink stamp on the leather strap - a rhombus or something similar

Rafal

[Mr. B.]

Rafal, May I post a couple of your pictures on other bayonet collectors sites? I have no luck finding any references or information. Thanks. Mike

[Beryl]

Mike,
Of course, your welcome
Raf

[Beryl]

Ring diameter inside

17.5mm

[Beryl]

I didn't notice that on one side the bayonet has the number 3138 on the covers and on the other side it has the number 3139

[Mr. B.]

Yeah, I was surprised to see a serial number on a grip panel. They are usually on metal. The two different numbers are probably part numbers (R-L) or mold numbers. Good possibility they are different somehow, perhaps on the inside, and do not interchange!?
We are all curious. This one has us mystified. Any new hints or information. Maybe backtrack on who and where you found it or any links to the Zastava group you mentioned? Mike

[Beryl]

The bayonet, or rather two identical ones, was bought at an antiques fair where they were lying together with the Yogo bayonets for Zastawa 56.
I was looking for information about Yugo bayonets for unusual weapons modeled on Soviet ones, e.g. SKS.
After the breakup of Yugoslavia, perhaps one of the countries, Slovenia or another, could have produced such bayonets???
Maybe it's some kind of test/experimental bayonet???
Maybe it's an export bayonet???
I have no idea.

The numbers look burned into the covers. The form number should be underneath - I think so.

[Beryl]

Maybe it is connected with the Balkans, Bulgaria, Romania or Albania?

[CarlosC]

It looks like it could fit an early AK with some sort of barrel extension. I used a ruler to take a quick look at my AK74s and it appears the tip of the flash hider is about 17mm, so it would clear the ring. An extension like an AK74 muzzle brake/flash hider would move the attachment point for the ring forward (like an AK-74), but the teeth would allow it to lock into the early AK "fangs" under the front sight base. The ring would secure it onto the flash hider tip. There are AK74 style flash hiders in 14x1L, so it is possible. Any chance you can measure the distance from the back of the ring to the teeth?

What an interesting design and such an unusual and rare item!

[Beryl]

From the ring to the end of the teeths 100 mm

[Beryl]

And picture

[Mr. B.]

The more I study these pictures, the more questions I have. How is the blade tang attached to the pommel? Smooth ground rivet(s)? It would help to see the back end and bottom of the pommel. I would assume the sliding part of the latch is installed from the bottom? Where is the “U” shaped spring that holds the sliding part in place and provides the tension to work the latch. There is no room or access for one in the pommel. Perhaps the machining and assembly place the spring in front of the latch behind the grip panels. Again it would help to see the hilt with the grip panels removed.
Actually this does not appear to be a functional bayonet!? It would not mount on a rifle? It is incomplete? On an AK47 bayonet the pommel ears position the rear of the bayonet and absorb the thrust and tilt. The muzzle ring positions the front of the hilt. All the latch does is keep the bayonet from sliding off to the front. The latch provides no vertical support. There is nothing on this bayonet to keep the pommel end attached!
I can see no advantage to have the barrel extend beyond the front sight base latch point. The gain in length is small and the proximity of the barrel to the top of the blade is also small. Not much room for any kind of muzzle device, Also the barrel could still not extend much beyond the muzzle ring for the bayonet blade to be used.
Maybe it is a non-functional experimental or prototype item. Why and what for remains?
Or maybe someone just made it up as a fantasy item for collectors to fight over???????
Regards, Mike

[Mr. B.]

[Beryl]

Fake - this would be the simplest answer, but the bayonet is made in a factory, not at your uncle's workshop. This is indicated by traces of processing and very careful workmanship. Besides, they were bought for the price of fries, maybe + cola. I have been collecting bayonets for 27 years (German, from sockets to World War II) and I have already seen various "bayonet wonders". So this hypothesis is out.
Just because we haven't seen something or don't know something doesn't mean it's fake.
If I don't have to disassemble the bayonets for maintenance, I don't disassemble them.
Back to your questions. I am posting more detailed photos.
The head is riveted - two rivets are visible.
The latch spring is hidden under the covers, I believe.
The inlet for the mounting rail looks like the Mauser 98. So I assume that such a rail was under the barrel. There were two cuts in it into which the fangs entered. In this way, the bayonet had two mounting places - on the barrel and under the barrel.

Ave

[Beryl]

And