Belt Hanger Identification

[RPBCPS]

Gents,
Can anyone identify from which country this hanger comes from?

I have looked through all the belt hangers on the other bayonets in my collection, that I have just 'cleared the dust off', and can find none which resembles this one, amongst them.

Thanks
Richard

[Mr. B.]

Hi Richard. The hanger you posted is generally thought of as being Yugoslavian. However that may not be true. This version seems to have been made by one of the countries involved in the 1990s Balkan conflict. They became some what common with surplus field gear after that. The one you picture appears to be one of the more well built ones with nice leather with embossed edge lines. The hilt strap stud is similar to the Yugo brass ones. The folded metal bracket is unusual as the ends are angular instead of round or oval. The snap hook is similar to the ones found on a variety of USA and NATO field gear. These ersatz or field expedient hangers are often crudely built and individually hand made. They incorporate a wide variety of leather, snap hooks, "D" rings, brackets, rivets and studs with different finishes from natural to black. Evidently there was a shortage of belt hangers during this conflict and replacement were made up as required.
Mike

[RPBCPS]

Cheers Mike,
That makes sense, I have a few Bosnian Fleur de Lys magazines in my collection with improvised flat springs from the same period, I probably picked the hanger up from the same source.

Richard

[Mr. B.]

By the way welcome to the forum! Nice looking collection! Lots of interesting items. Any plans to display it? Please feel welcome to share any info or pictures that you might have. Thanks for pointing out that the forum is lacking pictures and info on Yugo hangers. I'll try to start a new hanger topic with pictures under Yugoslavia and include the ersatz ones too.
Mike

[Mr. B.]

Here are pictures of the snap hook assemblies used of your ersatz Yugo hanger. These hooks were mass-produced by various US and foreign companies with minor variations. They were used on all sorts of military field gear from the 1950s -1970s. They are readily available even today in sizes from 3/4" to 2". The one pictured below is what I call a pack strap. It's a 2" wide carry strap that narrows down to a 1" snap hook. Available in bulk from many surplus stores.
Mike

US GI Militay Snap Hooks 4.jpg (6.38 KiB) Viewed 15372 times

[Mr. B.]

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[Mr. B.]

I posted a new topic under the Yugo heading for the hangers and straps. These ersatz hangers could have been made at any place at any time. They are easy to hand fabricate using surplus bits and pieces. Many could have been made up for the collectors market. Because of this, I don't really collect them, just pick up random different ones at times. They are not an official issued military pattern from any ComBloc country. Mike

[RPBCPS]

Mike,
Thanks for all that information, I appreciate that and for the welcome too.

I have just read your post on the Yugoslavian AKM Belt Hangers & Wrist Straps, great information thanks. I have one Yugoslavian Bayonet without a hanger, so now you have confirmed it is a correct hanger for the Balkans wars, I can use that one for it.

One of these days I'll get time to display them. I have just finished cataloguing them all, 82 bayonets all together, but some are duplicated, Soviet 6X3's and 6X4's for example and a handful of Polish bayonets.

Again thanks for all the information.

Richard

[RPBCPS]

Mike,
Perhaps you can help with this one?

It is on an arsenal refurbished Soviet 6X3, but I don't think it is a Russian hanger?

Stay safe

Richard

[Mr. B.]

From the 1st picture my guess was a one found on reworked Russian AKM 6X3 Type I bayonets. You confirmed it under the 2nd picture. When these bayonets were replace by 6X4 bayonets they were inspected and reworked before being placed in storage as reserves. Usually new hangers were installed. They used what ever was available and serviceable. From the standard new and old style (round and flat ring) Tula and Izhevsk (tan and brown pebble leather) plus all sorts of NOS to newly made approved variations. Some used a variety of old and new style brackets, rings and hooks, some black, others natural metal. The leather had different colors and finishes, some even used a combination of canvas webbing and leather. All were basically the same size and pattern and the only requirement was that they were functional. Check them out under "Russia" "Snap Hook Hangers" Mike

[RPBCPS]

Mike,
Thanks for the feedback, this site has reignited my interest in my collection, which has been in 'hibernation' since 2015. This hanger is on a Izhevsk 6X3 rework, I have several them in the collection.

Richard

[MDIvie]

Richard, glad you found us. I'm glad to be back on here too. I had an old age moment and forgot my passord and had to have Brian help me out.

[RPBCPS]

Martin,
Thanks appreciate that.

I often have issues with passwords too!

A friend of mine, that I served in the military with, is driving across to Allen today to collect his son for the Thanksgiving holiday.

[RPBCPS]

Mike,
Here are a couple more hangers, can you help on identification, I was told they were Soviet.

and the second one:

Stay safe
Richard

[Mr. B.]

Yes, Russian. Very early AKM 6X3 Type I hangers. Check them out in the "Russia" section, "Russian Snap Hook Hangers AKM - AK74" (there are two pages). Both are long since obsolete, but the 1st one is the basis for the one made and used by Poland up through the AK-74 series of rifles with minor differences. The 2nd one was one of several styles the Russians tried out before settling on the inverted "T" snap hook hanger still in use today. Mike

[RPBCPS]

Mike,
Thanks for that information, with all the different variations, we could start a collection of bayonet hangers.
I'll check out that section.
Richard

[Mr. B.]

Yeah, that sounds good, just collect the hangers and maybe the wrist straps too. As if identifying all the Kalashnikov bayonets and scabbards wasn't hard enough. It's taken years to build up collections and references, now we have to start all over again from scratch with very little information and references to collect hangers. Here's a start for you. Below are pictures of the Russian version of the snap hook hanger along with the synthetic vinyl version compared to the Polish version. On the Polish version the leather belt loop is either sewn together or uses only a single rivet. There are probably only a couple dozen different Polish ones with minor variations Different shades and finishes of leather, embossed edge lines or not. Many variations of rivet sizes and shapes, Maybe different styles of snap hooks. Think I'll just stick with the bayonets and not get too involved in the accessories!? Mike

[Mr. B.]

I just noticed another difference on the random samples I grabbed for pictures. The Russian ones used hollow rivets with one domed head. The Polish ones have double headed flattened domed rivets. Note also the different sized heads on the rivets on the Polish hangers. Are you sure you want to try collecting all the hanger variations Mike

[RPBCPS]

Mike,
Well spotted.
Richard